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CAT in production pipeline
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  • focomoso
  • Posted: 30 August 2010 11:09 AM
  • Location: Los Angeles, CA
  • Total Posts: 627
  • Joined: 02 February 2007 12:45 PM

Hi gang,

I’m a loooooong time Biped user (was a beta tester for the original CS) and am about to go into production on a project that will have a lot of very simple character animation, but I’m worried about using a system that is essentially dead. I’ve played with cat some and it looks great, but it has been very buggy for me in older max versions (2010 especially). It seems better in 2011, but I haven’t really put it to the test.

Do people have experience using CAT in a high-speed production pipeline? This is for TV and while the level of animation isn’t too sophisticated, it has to be very exact and we’ll be working very fast and can’t lose time with un-work-around-able bugs / crashes.

Would people recommend sticking with biped and sucking up its limitations in favor of its stability?



--
James Kelly
fo co mo so

Replies: 3
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Hi, I’m working with CAT - max 2009 approximately 2 years. I really know what you mean by high-speed production, and CAT good enough. I tried a lot of animation system in max or maya, actually you can’t find any animation (also rigging) system faster than CAT, believe me. CAT works best in max 2009 now, even 2011 has lot of crashes. CAT has some simple individual problems with individual solutions like any other programs. There is no problem that I couldn’t find solution by now. You can take a look my works with CAT, http://cankiral.com/category/download If you have any trouble in CAT don’t hesitate ask me. I always said that; there is nothing that you can’t do with CAT. Be brave! :D

Author: cankiral

Replied: 30 August 2010 12:06 PM  
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Thanks, cankiral. I like your CAT work very much. Nice flow. Do you have experience with multiple characters in the same scene? We have some shots with 6 speaking characters and many more peripheral characters.

Author: focomoso

Replied: 30 August 2010 12:48 PM  
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I animated 12 character at the same scene today at the work. I struggled with villagers :) We are animating TV cartoon series named Keloglan here, and we use CAT. You can take a look at cartoon that I mentioned; http://cankiral.com/keloglan_showcase It’s really great plugin.

Author: cankiral

Replied: 31 August 2010 06:24 AM  
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  • tyree
  • Posted: 30 August 2010 02:33 PM

there were other versions before 2009 that were stable and the same claim could have been made. it depends on where you came in at. if you have more than one version of max with cat in it. thats safer than only having one version to rely on. but once you learn it. I doubt there will be a problem you cant solve easily. I think thats more your concern, how hard is it to solve problems that pop up when using cat. I started using it, when it was still a seperate plugin. havent used another animation system since



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  • Gräck
  • Posted: 31 August 2010 02:50 AM

You need to know how to use it. Once you do something wrong, means you work against the CAT logic, you are likely to run into crashes and unexpected behaviour. Use it how it is meant to be used and it can be really fast, flexible, customizable and a huge time-saver in production. Have a look at my demoreel to see how complex CAT rigs can turn out. Most of the stuff in my demoreel was made for games, one of them a 2-year production with hundreds of characters…



My CAT demoreel:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gfq-4VoeAPU

Replies: 3
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You need to know how to use it

I would question whether undertaking a new project with tight deadlines is the right time to be learning something new. In the long run CAT will probably win out as it it clearly a better system, but I would suggest that James would be better off, on this occasion, using Biped (which he knows and is stable) rather than risking CAT. Just IMO, of course.

Author: Steve_Curley

Replied: 01 September 2010 12:11 AM  
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This is my concern, Steve. Learning on the job is hard enough as it is, but if you’re learning something that has its own set of quirks, it makes it even harder.

But then the question becomes, when can you actually make the switch? I’m always either on a mission critical project, or just fooling around and I don’t have enough fooling around time to push things hard enough to see where they break. At some point I’m just going to have to bite the bullet and switch, but the more stable CAT is before I switch, the better I’ll feel.

Author: focomoso

Replied: 01 September 2010 09:15 AM  
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Given your vast production experience with CAT, I was wondering if you could answer what may be a very simple workflow question for me:

I am building several characters, using the same basic mesh as their base.  They’re going to be different heights, and have different facial features, but will all require basically the same rig, just resized.  Is this the sort of operation CAT is useful for? 

And do you have any experience moving between Max with CAT and MotionBuilder and then back again?

Author: che broadnax

Replied: 22 February 2011 06:00 PM  
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  • lhep
  • Posted: 31 August 2010 05:02 AM

Has anyone integrated CAT into a version control system such as Perforce?  Or do most use features such as rig-update, Pose and clip libraries locally?



Replies: 0
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  • Gräck
  • Posted: 31 August 2010 09:49 PM

Yes, I have used CAT with SVN. You can edit the default library folders for rig presets/clips etc. in the cat.ini.



My CAT demoreel:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gfq-4VoeAPU

Replies: 3
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Got it.  Thanks.

Author: lhep

Replied: 01 September 2010 02:52 AM  
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Nice tutorials, & cool demo; thanks.

Author: SuperCoon

Replied: 01 September 2010 03:07 AM  
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Yes, Gräck’s tutorials are great. I am still patiently waiting for Gräck to create his in-depth CAT tutorial series, which I am willing to pay good money for. :)

Author: MadViolinist

Replied: 01 September 2010 11:22 AM  
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  • tomacmuni
  • Posted: 01 September 2010 01:15 AM

If you save the mesh elements with the CAT rig you can easily place multiple copies of a rig into a scene.

Sometimes Cat rigs display position glitches that can be disconcerting but usually fixed by scrubbing the time slider.



Replies: 0
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Can you give an example of your workflow with CAT?
Im really in doubt about how to mix layers between catmotion animation, and another layer as ABS. For example. The character walks 2 seconds, then jump, and continue walking.
Thanks



Replies: 0