One thing is for sure: DUAL xeon (x5600 series) + windows 7 + 3ds max 2011 = poor viewport performance.

Has autodesk atempted to test 3ds max with something close to this configuration?

And when you see LOTS of people complaining about the same problem, people that sometimes spend their own time (and resources) to try to help autodesk to find problems with their software, I think that it should be more than enough for further investigation.

Thanks,
Ricardo

p.s.: If I can help any further, please let me know. But I´m positive that if you do a clean install of 3ds max 2011 (plus hot fixes) in a dual xeon (x5600 series), a good amount of RAM and a quadro fx 3800, you´ll have a very good chance to have the same problems (very poor viewport performance)

I never submitted my specs, so maybe that will help some the techie gurus.  See below:

BOXX Workstation 8500
OS:  Windows 7 64-bit clean install (originally Windows Vista Ultimate 64-bit)
CPU:  WS DUAL XEON X5550 2.66GHz, 8MB cache, 1333 MHz
Memory:  12GB DDR3-1333 REG ECC (6 - 2GB DIMMS) (R)
Video Cards:  NVIDIA Quadro FX 3800 1GB PCI-E (R), NVIDIA Quadro FX 580 PCI-E (R)
(driving 2 Samsung 245T 24” monitors)
Hard Drives: 250GB 7,200rpm SATA (SUB), 500GB 7,200rpm SATA (SUB)
RAID:  RAID 5 Configuration (Add In Card Used)
Storage Contr.:  Adaptec 5805 SATA/SAS 8 Port Controller (R)

Based on comments on this discussion board, I’ve done the following:
- Physically removed the NVIDIA Quadro FX 580 card, using only FX 3800 to drive single monitor
- updated Samsung 245T monitor driver
- installed Max 2011 2010.07.21 (most-recent) Hotfix
- turned off ‘View Cube’ in Max 2011
- tried both the 258.96 and the 259.12 Quadro driver releases

There has been no change for me unfortunately.  Max viewport response is horrible.

Of interest, video playback on Adobe Premiere Pro CS5 is also atrocious.  Video playback and refresh appears to be affected globally.

I wish I was better with some of the technicals, but could any of this be related to my RAID 5 configuration, at least with the Premiere playback performance issues?

Any advice on next steps?

Mcquarrie

Ken, I had thought to respond to your question in a private email, but I think that feedback from others would be appropriate.  Based on my 20 years dealing with 3D Studio & 3DS Max and the various companies associated with the product, here are my thoughts.

1. Answer emails.  Even if you cannot provide an answer, it’s not appropriate to leave customers hanging in limbo.  We stake our businesses on this product, I don’t think this is too much to ask. 

2. Make sure that there are some product professionals at trade shows to answer questions.  It is not helpful to anyone if Autodesk only provides sales people to sell us products.  We deserve an opportunity to talk with the people who build the product.  I am confident that this would also be helpful to Autodesk as well.  It gives you a “heads up” regarding possible problems, but also provides useful input for future features.  That being said, I know you and others were at Siggraph, but it is pointless if you are not available to talk with your customers (I personally made 4 attempts including having an email sent to you from the show floor.)

3. Offer a support system for people who are reporting software issues.  There is no problem letting people pay when they can’t learn the product or don’t know how to build a primitive, but don’t shut out those who are trying to alert you to software problems. 

I will give you a practical example of this:  We do not have a “Gold” support contract with our subscription, as we understand how to use Max.  When we have attempted to initiate a ticket with Tech support for this issue, we were told that we were not eligible for support.  In order to push the matter further, we enlisted help from our local Autodesk vendor.  A ticket was initiated only to be abandoned by Autodesk with no followup.

4. Alert users to updates and patches.  You have a communication center and subscription center for providing information.  There have been two hot fixes since the release of 2011 and I had to hear about them from Boxx and others.  I don’t know why these patches never showed up on the Communications Center or on the subscription page.  This may be something I am doing wrong, but as I have been heavily engaged in the problem since your 2011 release, I should not have to search for patches.  In fact, if you had a problem reporting system for software issues, I am certain that it could be programmed to alert people to patches that address their registered problem.

5. Treat all of your customers the same way you would treat Pixar. My business is just as important to me as Pixar is to Disney.

Ken, as I mentioned, I have bent over backwards to communicate our findings to both Autodesk and other Max users.  It was, and still is my intent to help Autodesk and the user community address this problem, as it is in everyone’s best interest.  However I should point out that it is difficult to stop and write an hour long email of every test we conducted only to have it go into some black hole without any follow up.  All I have ever asked for was a little communication.

I am sure that there are others who may have an opinion on how Autodesk could better serve its customers, and I hope perhaps they will make constructive suggestions as well.

Per pyro777, I installed Microsoft Windows 7 Hotfix KB2028560 (albeit hesitantly, as I don’t understand why this is not part of the mainstream update.) I saw no improvement (but thanks for the idea).

Per Ken, I did the following:
- in the BIOS, disabled hyperthreading
- uninstalled the Logitech mouse drivers
- turned off Gamma (I assume you meant Gamma Correction in Customize > Preferences > Gamma and LUT
- played with Adaptive Degredation toggle and settings

Unfortunately, none of this helped at all.

Even using only Internet Explorer on this machine, I feel like the screen “skips” when scrolling a simple website.  As previously mentioned, Adobe Premiere CS5 is also barely working on the same box, which makes me think this is more related to an unknown cacophony between the Boxx 8500, Nvidia Quadro FX 3800 and Windows 7 64-bit.

My next steps are seeing if I can’t get Boxx and Nvidia to do some chatting seeing as bcouzens and myself are having so many of the same issues with similar system configurations.  Phil from Nvidia—does Nvidia have any plans to release an FX 3800 performance driver for 3ds Max 2011 anytime soon? 

In the meantime, please keep the ideas coming.  Thanks.

Mcquarrie

Good news.  I just got off the phone with Autodesk (Thanks Ken) and they have been able to reproduce the problem (yes they authorized me to let you know.) Not the answer everyone is looking for, but it is definitely a first step toward a solution.

Thanks to bcouzens, Ken (Autodesk) and Phil (Nvidia) for hunting this down.  My assumption is this will not be fixed tomorrow or next week, so I am going to have to revert to xp64 and 2011.  I will watch this thread for updates.

Any update about the viewport/performance issues?

Thanks,
Ricardo

Finally got rid of Windows 7 and did a clean install of xp64 and Max 2011.  Viewports appear to be working very well again!

Anyone want to buy three Windows 7 licenses?  Right now, one is working as a great $200.00 coffee cup stand.

Thanks for the update.  I think I will schedule an immediate rollback to see if we have a similar result.  Don’t sell your Win 7 yet, I passed on your info, and they have multiple companies working on the problem (most have replicated some version of it.)

Brian

We’ve just got word from NVidia, they have now reproduced the problem and are now focusing on root cause analysis. If I hear anymore I’ll let you know. Guess for the moment, the 3800 card is pretty useless…