Doesnt Maya have bugs also? Ive never used it though.  I thought all software has had bugs at one time or another.

I’m glad I will never know.

Yes, virtually all software has bugs, even my own. Mostly are unknown and only triggered in rare and non-standard situations. This is where 3dsmax differs from other software. 3dsmax is a bug minefield, you WILL bump into one during every day use, very frequently. And very often it is crippling, that is, it is not a nuisance, but really obstructs your work.

As ‘power user’, the bug occurrence rate increases almost exponentially. For example, I’d say that about 25% of the lines of code in the many MaxScripts I have written over the years are actually bug workarounds.

I have never EVER seen a product with so many bugs as 3dsmax. Sure 3dsmax is incredibly complex, but that is no excuse, ESPECIALLY regarding the pricetag, and bug reports streaming in en masse from a huge user base.

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This one goes to oracle3d as well: software bugs triggered by ‘normal’ everyday use are unacceptable in ANY situation, no excuses (not having enough memory is NOT a valid excuse, it should report an error warning instead of crashing).

If it is a known bug, it should always be fixed. All other software companies (even including Microsoft) adhere to that standard. Autodesk DOES NOT. If a software vendor tells you (as end-user) a bug is your fault, they are lying.

I think Remdul has some good points.  I use Blender as well as 3ds Max and I can tell you that Blender does not crash and hang as much as 3ds Max.  I think Max has better UV tools and better rendering options, but Blender’s modeling tools and rigging options are pretty amazing.  Especially for FREE.  With open source software improving so fast companies like Autodesk need to take notice. 

Having said that, I don’t think that the issues I’ve had with 3ds Max are a hindrance to my work.  It’s still a good app with a large user base.  I personally use Max, Blender, and ZBrush.  They all have their strengths as well as quircks.  I just think that Remdul has been using Max for so long he is just intimately acquainted with its issues.  All apps have issues.  If he’s going to stop using Max he’ll just be trading Max issues for another app’s issues.

I just think that Remdul has been using Max for so long he is just intimately acquainted with its issues.

I’m glad you noticed.

Yes, it sort of hurts. I know it is just a piece of software, but having seen 3dsmax ‘grow up’ (LOL!) to becoming this piece of [censored] is downright staggering (pardon the choice of words, I don’t think there’s a better way to describe it). Maybe I’ve spend to much time using it, but it just hurts to see it fail so miserably every once in a while. Sometimes I come across a bug so stupid, I’m not sure whether I should smack my keyboard around or just walk away and go do something else. It wasn’t always like this, 3dsmax 2.5 worked really neat despite the crashes, and still remains my favorite version.

All apps have issues.  If he’s going to stop using Max he’ll just be trading Max issues for another app’s issues.

Other apps will have their problems no doubt, but they cannot possibly have as many as 3dsmax has. I think other software developpers will ACTIVELY have to add bugs to their software to reach a similar buggy state like 3dsmax is in.

Of course Open Source is a very good solution and has my preference. Autodesk should take note, and start actively working RIGHT NOW to prepare them selves. Open Source happens, inevitable, it is a wave and coming right at us. It will destroy Autodesk unless they improve their software, but I highly doubt they ever will (and in the case of 3dsmax, they can’t). That’s why I’m abandoning 3dsmax now. I’m ready to ride that wave. Are you?

(Sorry if I sound like a troll, but I think it this is justified by my years of experience.)

I can certainly sympathize.  I left Lightwave when they hit version 9.  I was so angry that what I felt were long standing issues were not being addressed I jumped ship and tried other apps.  I’m glad I did, not because LW is bad, but because I’ve got some perspective now.  Can’t hurt to test the waters.  Good luck to you!

Where you would go? XSI? I understand your concerns as i fight with max in my daily production, but I love so many things about it at the same time. I have posted things on this topic before but I will give my thoughts again. For me there are many places max needs to improve on since I mainly use it for TV commercial work. I feel that Autodesk dose not want to step on 3rd party plug-ins and add on companies. The volumetric system in max is just not up to par. And particle flow needs so much more than what it offers (I love particle flow) but I do not think I should have to purchase Particle Flow Tools that feel like they should be part of the app to begin with. Lets face it, Sub D modeling in max is achievable, but can be so time consuming working with modifiers and the stack that the bad out way good. Another thing I am not a fan of is Reactor. Could just be me but I feel like its too much work to set up things for the most simple tasks. I think what it boils down to for me is that every function in max seems so separate from the app itself there is no “Zen” or unison to what you are doing. Personally thats a big factor to why I am growing tired of it. I need to feel that the app I am using has good “bones” so to speak and a level of integration between all aspects of it. It may also sound strange but the way things look from buttons to colors has an influence on me too. Max just looks dated and there is no getting around it. As much as a UI overhaul would upset most people for me I would LOVE to see modern looking buttons and a UI change. These are just little gripes but for me its like working in an office without plants, something just does not feel right.

So back to what else you would use.....I have no answer because overall you can do so much with max I’m just not sure where you would go. XSI seems the most tempting to me but I cant speak for it as I have not ventured there yet.

Remdul:

I’m sure having a noob like myself defending the app you’ve grown to hate isn’t helping matters. I’ve only been using Max for about a year and a half (started with ver 8 and now working with ver 9). Studio Max and SketchUp are the only modeling tools I’m even mildly acquainted with.

As a low-level user I don’t run into the same problems as a seasoned vet, so perhaps my initial reply was a bit hasty. Apologies for the diaper remark.

JMac

These kinds of thread are why I stopped reading forum posts.  If you don’t like the application you are using then stop using it.  I know you made an investment, but just don’t upgrade.  I can assure you one thing… you’ll be complaining over at the new forum of the application you switched to.

I use 3DMAX everyday and I have been for about 10 years.  3DSMAX, like ALL other applications, has bugs.

People, relax.  It’s just an opinion, and we do not need to be overly concerned with every opinion.  However, criticism is OK, and may end up helpful.  We do preach democracy everywhere else, so how about we let a little of it in here.  You won’t always like what other’s do or say, but without it, you’d like things even less.

Who knows, maybe they’ll ban Remdul (doubtful), or they may listen to his complaints and look into some issues (possible, but keep breathing), or they may just ignore the whole affair (possible).

Anyway, you supporters are allowed to voice your opinions, just don’t work too hard at trying to silence the dissenters.  However, I don’t want that to be interpreted as an invitation to []-itch.  You need to complain, fine, go ahead.  If you have some areas that can be addressed, perhaps list them and see if anything changes.

Bobby W Parker, bugs are NOT acceptable. There are no excuses. Ok, they happen, fine. But somehow other software vendors manage to fix them, why not with 3dsmax? THAT is my issue.

I like the 3dsmax GUI. I like how it is modular. I like being able to script stuff. To bad it completely falls apart when you actually try to put all those nice features to use.

I’m serious. I’ve seen no improvement over the years. I have no faith left in Autodesk. What am I supposed to do? Say it is great, and all that? I and others have posted enough constructive advice over the years, but little happens. I feel screwed over. I’m pissed. THAT is democracy.

And don’t make me any illusions Mr. Maneswar_Cheemalapati. Autodesk knows damn well what the problems are.

(I don’t mean to get personal though.)

You mean crashing 3-4 times a day and loosing hours of work weekly isn’t normal ;).  having said that I have learned to backup my backups and I save often.  hasn’t that been the M.O. with MAX since day one?

Is your hardware keeping up with your software?  I had a couple issues when I upgraded to 2009, but they are graphic card driver issues.